Tuesday, March 27, 2007

Collecting

Okay, now I'm torqued off. I'm collecting examples from the left side of the Internet that actually has something encouraging or sympathetic to say about Tony Snow having a re-occurrence of cancer. I have seen plenty of vile hate at Daily Kos, DU, Huffpo, and other progressive sites (thankfully, 90% of the viciousness is in the comments, not the posts). Are there any definitely left sites which have posted kind comments unmixed with gratuitous nastiness?

On a related note, please send me any examples of conservative sites which have posted a hope that Elizabeth Edwards would suffer or die. I am seeing nothing but the kindest wishes for her to date.

This contrast is simply abominable. Please restore my faith that there remain some on the left who retain human decency.

20 comments:

reddog said...

I haven't seen any bad comments about Tony or Elizabeth. I did see some nasty comments about Jimmy Carter being assassinated.

People really seem to hate the poor old gentleman.

Exile From Hillary's Village said...

If there are any good wishes amongst the left-wing sites they are lost in the thousands of vicious, hateful comments from the "peace loving" Left wishing Tony Snow a prolonged, extremely painful death for no other reason than his being a convenient target of their "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy" theories.

On the other hand the worst thing that I've seen regarding Mrs. Edwards' plight is that it might, possibly, have been a ploy by Edwards to get the sympathy vote. Even then, the people who brought up that subject were shut down very quickly.

The Left will always be the Left. Remember: these people are in the same political boat that killed 100 million people in the 20th century, whether they know it or not. Viciousness is all they know.

Jerub-Baal said...

It has always seemed to me that posturing, bile, and threats are the activities of marginalized people (who are denying that they are marginalized).

It's interesting that in spite of the new Democrat Party majority the far left still acts like it feels marginalized.

Down in their subconscious, or whatever, the left knows that their beliefs are worthless.

Kelly said...

Carter isn't so much hated as despised, for his peculiar combination of feckless sanctimony. I truly hope it doesn't come to this, but Jimmy has the possibility of becoming the next generation's Neville Chamberlain.

Assistant Village Idiot said...

You guys are making me worse...

jaed said...

Hmmm. I did a trawl through lefty blogs in my bookmarks. I regret to say it was a depressing exercise. There were few outright hateful posts (I leave aside the comments sections), but most mentions contained ample snark, name-calling at Snow in the midst of possibly-sincere well-wishes, etc.

That being said, Andrew Sullivan said, "Another public figure is facing mortality with grace."

Talking Points Memo also had a graceful post: "Our collective best wishes to Tony Snow. It's been a sobering several days, with Snow's cancer recurrence and that of Elizabeth Edwards. It's a reminder that with all our technology, the best medical care available, which I'm sure both of these two have, we're still vulnerable to being stricken in the prime of our lives by organic processes emerging from within our own bodies that we cannot control. I admire the bravery of both of them. It reminds you of the need to live every moment, every day and year, at the outer boundary of its possibilities, its potential."

Hilzoy at Obsidian Wings also had a brief mention as an update to another post: "And while I'm adding things: my heart goes out to Tony Snow and his friends and family."

There is also a cri de coeur at MyDD: "Cancer is purple."

(In the article linked by Sullivan, one commenter makes a nasty remark about Elizabeth Edwards, and is then unanimously called out by other commenters. I'm not sure whether this qualifies for your second category, since it's a comment rather than a post.)

I hope this helps, or at least doesn't make it worse...

Erin said...

A friend of a friend (why does that phrase sound so uncredible?) serves in our state legislature. Apparently the same type of bias was taking place this week. There was a bill up about greyhound racing and 10 citizens showed up. They allowed each some time to present their arguments. There were 500 there to oppose the new same-sex marriage ammendment/bill, but they only allowed 3 of those people a short time to present remarks.

Anonymous said...

As you requested:

Josh Marshall:

"Our collective best wishes to Tony Snow. It's been a sobering several days, with Snow's cancer recurrence and that of Elizabeth Edwards. It's a reminder that with all our technology, the best medical care available, which I'm sure both of these two have, we're still vulnerable to being stricken in the prime of our lives by organic processes emerging from within our own bodies that we cannot control. I admire the bravery of both of them. It reminds you of the need to live every moment, every day and year, at the outer boundary of its possibilities, its potential."

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/013276.php

Huffington Post Poster RJ Eskow:

"Before this news came out I saw somebody other than the man I see today. Today I see somebody with a family, somebody who loves guitars like I do, somebody who may be fighting for his life.

That doesn't excuse his evasions, or the Administration's actions. But it does lead me to ask the question: Can we Americans ever restore the spirit of unity that we once shared, if only briefly?

I don't have any answers. But as I said at the outset, I wish Tony Snow the best. After all, we're in this thing together."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rj-eskow/can-americans-reconcile-_b_44402.html

Imitatio Christi Blog
(a politically progressive Christian blog)

"When it comes to political matters, Tony and I are on opposites the vast majority of the time, but when it comes to prayerful support for illness, none of that matters. The latest report on his surgery is not exactly what one might want to hear. So, I invite you to join with me in prayer for Tony's health and recovery."

TalkLeft:

Sad news from the White House today. Tony Snow's cancer has not only returned but spread to his liver. Cancer is not a political disease. I feel badly for him. May he keep an optimistic attitude and keep up the fight.

http://www.talkleft.com/story/2007/3/27/13250/6825

CarpetBagger:

I’ve read every transcript of every briefing Snow has led, and as regular readers know, I’m not shy about taking him to task when I disagree with his remarks.

But people obviously come before politics. I’m pulling for him, I applaud his courage and tenacity, and I extend my best wishes to him and his family.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/10332.html

NewsHounds:

FOXNews.com is reporting that Tony Snow's cancer has returned, this time to his liver. We wish the White House spokesman a full and speedy recovery.

http://www.newshounds.us/2007/03/27/best_wishes_tony_snow.php

DemocraticDaily

Sad news. The truth is cancer knows no boundaries. I don’t think I know anyone at this point who’s live has not been touched by cancer directly or indirectly...I hope that both Tony Snow and Elizabeth Edwards live long and happy lives.

http://blog.thedemocraticdaily.com/?p=5532

Shakespeare's Sister:

Constant Comment just emailed me with a sad note: Tony Snow's cancer has returned. "Tony Snow was off duty Monday to undergo exploratory abdominal surgery. The White House is now reporting that the surgery revealed that Snow's colon cancer has returned and metastasized into his liver. Snow had his colon removed in 2005, and White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said this morning that Snow is determined to 'beat' cancer again."

I hope he does. Obviously, liver cancer cancer in the liver is very serious, and he can use lots of good thoughts at the moment.

http://shakespearessister.blogspot.com/2007/03/best-wishes-tony-snow.html

MissLaura Front Page Diarist for DailyKos:

We are tempted to put a political spin on this, but I feel strongly we should refrain from going there...I wish smooth sailing to Tony Snow and his family through the weeks to come.

I know I can safely say Tony and his family have only the best wishes and good thoughts from those of us here on Dailykos....

Update: I know I don't have to tell you all this, but for the occassional troller - We at Dailykos do not swim in the Rush Limbaugh pool of scum. We do not wish ill-health on our political opponents or their families. We at Dailykos give our whole-hearted best wishes and prayers to Tony Snow and his family.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/3/27/1006/42536

Assistant Village Idiot said...

Thank you, anon. Most of those were indeed warm sentiments. The Huffpo and Daily kos ones couldn't keep their bile from leaking out, though. Congrats to the others. As jaed noted, sometimes the the snark and name-calling occurs within what may be heartfelt good wishes. I have to say I don't count those as kindness. Noting that one disagrees with Snow provides context; saying "that doesn't excuse his evasions..." is just another opportunity to be snide.

The others are legit though, and thank you again. I'm breathing a little better.

jaed said...

Actually, the comments on that Daily Kos post made me feel a little better. There are some very ugly ones, true - but they're not a high percentage, and are the general subject of remonstrances by other commenters.

Assistant Village Idiot said...

Excellent.

copithorne said...

From two minutes at Free Republic

"If Edwards gave two $hits about his wife he would abandon this impossible campaign for the White House and spend what little precious time he has left with his wife. I guess his decision to press on with a campaign he can't possibly win is just one more indicator of the weak character he possesses."

"Only a lawyer and hopeful politician would ride on the shoulders of a sick wife."

"Remember kiddies, do whatever it takes to get power and prestiege. Nothing else matters. Nothing. If you are a commie/liberal/democrate."

"Oh please. Spare us the phony sentimentality and shameless emotional pandering. IF this guy had any decency at all he would end his Presidential campaign right now to spend every remaining minute with his dying wife. This is shameless despicable emotional pandering. It should be held in contempt for the despicable emotional manipulation it is."

"No question Johnny Hairdo is looking to get some mileage out of this whole episode."

"The Breck Girl is indeed going to get mileage out of this. "

"Yes I know, maybe I was harsh, but it really ticks me off that this pig is living in several multi-million buck mansions off of the hard work of people whose only aim is to help people. Put it this way; If it wasn`t for doctors, there would be no help, everyone would just die with the slightest life threatening problem. It would be like the 1700`s.

If some company came up with something that said it may help his wife and it didn`t or god forbid made it worse, this POS Edwards would not hesitate for a second to knock them down and take them for every last dime they got. And you know what the ultimate result is? Less doctors, chemists and scientists wanting to get involved. Like one Doc I know, he said if it wasn`t for lawyers, cancer would have been cured 40 years ago as well as aids as well as every life threatening disease known to mankind. Don`t know if that is true, but I wouldn`t doubt it."

"This whole thing of the Edwards "educating" everyone on cancer is B.S.! What have we learned from them announcing her cancer is back? Nada! I think this is the ultimate in selfishness on his part"

"..and thirdly, the most cynical view of all and I feel guilty just contemplating it, she may not be sick at all. Edwards is after all a master craftsman of using victims to stir up emotion. Or perhaps knew of the recurrence long before it was announced on national tv, timed to give his sagging polls a boost. Really, any number of possibilities."


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1808152/posts

I don't need to search for these. I could post a hundred more.

copithorne said...

AVI, can you post the offensive comments you found on Daily Kos and Huffington Post. I searched, found this thread and couldn't identify any comments that were "hateful."

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/3/29/91952/5021?detail=f

copithorne said...

Here is a thread of hundreds of unqualified well wishes on Democratic Underground.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2782921&mesg_id=2782923

Assistant Village Idiot said...

copithorne, none of the quotes you provided wished Elizabeth Edwards ill in any way or expressed any joy that she had cancer. They criticised John, and less often his wife, for attempting to make political hay out the sadness. Quite different.

I think you are really unable to understand what doesn't fit your template.

For openers, there is Wonkette: " Under the heading of ‘What goes around comes around’, the cancer in Tony Snow is removing the cancer of Tony Snow from the national scene.

OMG, could there be a god?"

And Kevin Drum: "There’s been very few days over the last six plus years that I haven’t wished a long over due demise to the entire Bush administration and most of the Republican members of congress. These people are all, at a minimum, accessories to crimes against humanity. F*** all this sanctimony. The sooner were rid of these people, whatever the circumstances, the better for the nation and the world."

Charles Karol Bouley, at Huffpo "I hear about Tony Snow and say to myself, well, stand up every day, lie to the American people at the behest of your dictator-esque boss and well, how could a cancer NOT grow in you. Work for Fox News, spinning the truth in to a billion knots and how can your gut not rot? I know, it's terrible. I admit it. I don't wish anyone harm, even Tony Snow. And I do hope he recovers or at least does what he feels is best and surrounds himself with friends and family for his journey. But in the back of my head there's Justin Timberlake's "What goes around, goes around, comes around, comes all the way back around, ya..."

You may have missed the quote because it has been removed.

Now, I knew these things already Copithorne, which is why I asked for the other side to restore my perspective. The posts here, and some that I have searched out on my own, have indeed been reassuring that many comments at the left-leaning sites have been of good will. I'm not sure why the whole idea of getting a different perspective is hard to grasp.

copithorne said...

wonkette is not a member of "the left." No how. No way. She's one of yours.

Kevin Drum's post about Tony Snow from his blog Washington Monthly is as follows:

"TONY SNOW....Between Cathy Seipp, Elizabeth Edwards, and now Tony Snow, it suddenly seems as if everyone has cancer. Just an illusion, I know, but still a distressing one. Here's hoping he recovers."

I would ask you to provide a link to your quote or apologize to Kevin Drum.

I've never heard of Charles Bouley. Personally I find his remarks an order of magnitude less spiteful than the quotes I offered from Free Republic. But I don't share his sense of how cancer develops.

copithorne said...

Here's the permalink for Kevin Drum's post about Tony Snow.

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2007_03/011013.php

Assistant Village Idiot said...

http://polipundit.com/index.php?p=17229

All three.

Wonkette is maverick left. Sorry you're not happy with her.

You may not have heard of Bouley, but he writes for HuffPo. The argument that he hasn't come to your attention is rather sixth-grade.

Drum is not always a bad guy. He did say some reasonable things about Snow. When one puts sick things in the midst of it, however, it undermines anything pleasant.

As to which is more spiteful, there is no comparison between stating that a person deserves suffering - that you delight in or approve of it in some way - and cynically accusing a person of using tragedy for personal gain. With that one comment, more than any other here, you brand yourself as a person unable to face uncomfortable information.

copithorne said...

Oh, I see. You misunderstood Polipundit.

He took these quotes from a comment board and you are attributing them to the blog owners. He scrolled through hundreds of kind posts to pull out the inflammatory ones without any context. Some people, including you I suppose, like to be inflamed. And if you want to be inflamed, you certainly will be.

I agree that a civilized person does not wish for another's suffering or pain.

At the same time, I've never heard anyone say "I'm sorry to hear of Osama Bin Laden's kidney failure. I pray that he and his wives may have God's blessing through this difficult time."

Assistant Village Idiot said...

Fair enough. They were visitors, which is a lower standard of acceptance than the blog owner.

The Daily Gut remains real, though removed.