tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post7448542471563349594..comments2024-03-27T03:19:11.216-04:00Comments on Assistant Village Idiot: Dialect, and Social SignallingAssistant Village Idiothttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01978011985085795099noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-64037323448360528262012-06-07T20:08:25.301-04:002012-06-07T20:08:25.301-04:00If you go south from Southern Illinois, the local ...If you go south from Southern Illinois, the local accent is less pronounced--at least until you get much farther south. Or it used to be.jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01792036361407527304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-25827059029268371422012-06-06T22:42:36.169-04:002012-06-06T22:42:36.169-04:00Anyway, on to social signalling...
There are turn...Anyway, on to social signalling...<br /><br />There are turns of phrase and uses of words (as well as inflection) which indicate <i>Arts & Humanities</i> culture.<br /><br />I think my first brush with that was trying to figure out why a certain Lit professor called one of <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Athena_Herakles_Staatliche_Antikensammlungen_2301_B_full.jpg" rel="nofollow">these things</a> a "Vahz", rather than a "Vays". <br /><br />I think I picked up on some other inflections at the time, though I can't remember them. The impression I got was Ivy-League/New England, Arts-and-Humanities tribe.<br /><br />At the time, this person was teaching humanities at a Technological University in the Midwest.<br /><br />In another field, there are buzzwords that run around the world of business and marketing. The higher a person moves in that world, the more comfortably they use the buzzwords. ("Synergy" and "Collaboration" are real things, but overuse of the words threatens to drain them of meaning.)karrdehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00205160745963596856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-89981076913595200172012-06-06T18:49:13.966-04:002012-06-06T18:49:13.966-04:00James - Joel Garreau's excellent Nine Nations ...James - Joel Garreau's excellent Nine Nations of North America groups southern Illinois in Dixie, and even identifies a border. Though the book was written in 1984, it remains an excellent resource for understanding regional differences, and I have come back to it many times. Google the title just for the map on the cover.<br /><br />The Arcadians - from which "Cajun" comes - were in Nova Scotia and New Brunswick until the English pushed them out in the 18th C. I think the main accent similarity is is in the inflection of sentences and accenting of syllables - the music of the speech.Assistant Village Idiothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01978011985085795099noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-63499142433122071862012-06-06T17:49:46.957-04:002012-06-06T17:49:46.957-04:00Southern Illinois is an isolated bastion of the so...Southern Illinois is an isolated bastion of the southern accents. I don't know why, but I used to live there and can testify.jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01792036361407527304noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-3259106161926525252012-06-06T15:12:00.161-04:002012-06-06T15:12:00.161-04:00I have never heard "evolution" used in t...I have never heard "evolution" used in that sense. I've been out of the AF for 25 years, though. And Coasties; well, I usta think of them as not a real service. I know better now:<br /><br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hO0gC_q6kYw<br /><br />http://www.ask.com/wiki/Coast_Guard_Station_Cape_Disappointment<br /><br />http://www.44mlb.com/movies.htm<br /><br />I heard a waitress in Champagne, IL, who sounded like a southerner. She was a local, been there all her life.Sam L.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-49545441325975429882012-06-06T11:48:24.317-04:002012-06-06T11:48:24.317-04:00I'm guessing that the original meaning of &quo...I'm guessing that the original meaning of "evolution" was related to a phrase for 'unrolling'.<br /><br />It came to be used among military organizations was to describe the progression of maneuvers/operations from a beginning to the current state, or to an endpoint. An 'unrolling' of events.<br /><br />The term was used in this form for a century or two before biologists began using it.<br /><br />However, that was the first time I had ever heard the word spoken in that way. I'd seen it used in writing many times (military-oriented novels, mostly), but never heard it.<br /><br />@Gringo,<br />now that I see the reasoning, I agree. I hadn't wanted to jump to a conclusion, though.karrdehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00205160745963596856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-9623574255653656402012-06-06T10:50:13.911-04:002012-06-06T10:50:13.911-04:00karrde
've been told that the "Cajun"...karrde<br /><i>'ve been told that the "Cajun" culture does contain a lot of influence that came from "Acadia", that was French-speaking portion of Canada in the mid-1700s.I can't really explain how a modern Quebecois accent could sound Cajun, though.</i><br /><br />My hypothesis is that similar linguistic origins will result in similar English accents for ESL speakers. The Cajun accent came about from the encounter of native French speakers of Canadian origin with the English language. Similarly, the plumber's English accent is the reaction of a native Canadian French speaker to the English language. <br /><br />It is interesting that even though nearly all Cajuns today are native English speakers, they still speak English with the inflections of their French ancestors. TV English is gradually changing that.<br /><br />[For historical accuracy, I should add that by the early 19th century, many Louisiana French had come from areas of French settlement in the Caribbean, as shown in the book <a href="https://www.google.com/search?tbo=p&tbm=bks&q=ancesters+slaveowners+intitle:one+intitle:drop+inauthor:broyard&num=10" rel="nofollow">One Drop.</a> Including free blacks who became slaveowners in Louisiana.]<br /><br />Granted, in one case we are dealing with late 20th century Canadian French contrasted with 18th century Canadian French, but there are enough similarities in the speech patterns to result in a similar English language accent.<br /><br />Granted that there are now substantial differences between Quebec French, Cajun French, and France as spoken in France.<br /><br />Another example of common linguistic origins resulting in similar English accents can be shown in the English accent of Trinidadians and West Africans. At least is that my reaction to hearing Trinidadians and West Africans speak English. In the case of Trinidadians, they are native English speakers- but Trinidadian English was formed by Trinidadians of West African origin. Black Trinidaidans can trace their origins back to West Africa.<br /><br />A further example of common linguistic origins and English accents would be German and English. Of all the non-native English speakers I have heard, the sound of Germans speaking English grates less on my ears compared to any other non-native English speaking group. Similarly, it would be my opinion that of all the languages an American could learn, German would be the easiest accent [NOT the grammar] to pick up. At least that is my admittedly limited experience with Germans and the German language.Gringonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-9122209877036371782012-06-06T09:41:27.314-04:002012-06-06T09:41:27.314-04:00I'm used to hearing "evolution" used...I'm used to hearing "evolution" used to denote an exercise, but mostly from fiction, I guess.<br /><br />Copspeak cracks me up: all that "subject exited the vehicle" stuff.<br /><br />To this day I can't bear to split an infinitive, certainly not in writing and practically never even in speech. I don't dangle participles, either, or mix up my nominative and subjective cases ("between him and I").<br /><br />People often say "You don't sound like you're from the South," I suppose because I grew up in the suburbs of a large city full of oil-business newcomers, and was raised on TV English. On the other hand, I can easily imitate a strong Texan accent, while I'd be hard pressed to do a convincing Brooklyn. One of the funniest things about Hollywood is its pathetic attempt to do Texan or Southern accents. As much as I loved "Lone Star," for instance, the female lead's South Texas chicana effort was a howler, sort of Puerto-RIco-meets-East-Coast. I don't reckon she'd ever been near Texas, bless her heart.Texan99https://www.blogger.com/profile/10479561573903660086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-86547532051279551972012-06-06T09:10:20.612-04:002012-06-06T09:10:20.612-04:00"once heard a Coast-Guard guy describe an eve..."once heard a Coast-Guard guy describe an event that he'd helped with as "the evolution". Took me a few moments to figure out that he meant the older meaning of "evolution", which predated its application to biology."<br /><br />Oh dear. I used to be considered pretty well read for my generation, which isn't saying a lot I realize, but have to ask. There's an older meaning of "evolution"?Kittennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-32211691883470044842012-06-06T07:54:13.620-04:002012-06-06T07:54:13.620-04:00@Gringo,
I've been told that the "Cajun&...@Gringo,<br /><br />I've been told that the "Cajun" culture does contain a lot of influence that came from "Acadia", that was French-speaking portion of Canada in the mid-1700s.<br /><br />I can't really explain how a modern Quebecois accent could sound Cajun, though. <br /><br />@Sam L, I once heard a Coast-Guard guy describe an event that he'd helped with as "the evolution". Took me a few moments to figure out that he meant the older meaning of "evolution", which predated its application to biology.<br /><br />I'm not sure that the Coasties count as military, but it's a mannerism I would expect from a military man.<br /><br />Similarly, one of my siblings has had his speech patterns altered by joining a police force. At least, when he describes something that he saw or experienced, his narration has shifted from Response (whether humorous, sarcastic, or intrigued) into a Sequence-Of-Events pattern, followed by a short interpretation.karrdehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00205160745963596856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-48301423933898563682012-06-06T00:50:10.859-04:002012-06-06T00:50:10.859-04:00When I taught school in TX, one student came up to...When I taught school in TX, one student came up to me after class one day and informed me that there were classes I could take to deal with my speech defect. I informed him that what he considered a speech defect was simply a New England accent- or what remained of mine.<br /><br />As the student was saying this in a respectful tone, I had to suppress my inclination to laugh.<br /><br />Last year a plumber did some work at my place. I asked him if he were from Louisiana, as he spoke with what appeared to me to be a Cajun accent. No, he said, he was from Quebec. His father was a French-Canadian from Manchester NH who had been sent to Quebec on some US military assignment, and decided to stay in Quebec.<br /><br />A next door neighbor who is from Monterrey Mexico also thought the plumber was from Louisiana.<br /><br />I told this to a neighbor, a native Texas, who had also used the services of the plumber. "That plumber speaks with a Yankee accent, just like you." Where anything not Texan is labeled as Yankee. <br /><br /><br />Here is an ABBA sighting from a report on the recall election in Wisconsin: <a href="http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/06/05/total-recall-the-polls-have-closed-in-wisconsin/" rel="nofollow">9:40: It’s time to break out the Abba, because Wisconsin is Waterloo for Big Labor.</a>Gringonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-19305198.post-25540183246372979332012-06-05T20:48:19.778-04:002012-06-05T20:48:19.778-04:00Those who have been in the services, or have lived...Those who have been in the services, or have lived in various places around the country, are partly homogenized, but have picked up phrases, certain locutions, slang from those places. Many will use these for fun. I do. I am careful, though, not to let some of my humorous sayings out until the new person knows me well enough (I hope) not to run off screaming thru the underbrush.Sam L.noreply@blogger.com